|Testimony From Jens Sethi|
Referenced From: http://www.myfreeoffice.com/saibabaexposed/jen.html
Experiences of an ex-Sai Baba
From : MUNICH, GERMANY Source : Jens Sethu - A letter to David
Subject : EXPERIENCES OF AN EX-SAI BABA DEVOTEE
My Response: Jens' last name is "Sethi", not "Sethu". This shows how much attention to details The Findings gave to his account
(This account contains rather frightening experiences with the Puttaparthi police and the true birth place of Sai Baba.)
Hello David Bailey,
I am giving you a thorough account of my traumatic experiences with Sathya Sai Baba and hope that this will help people understand what he is all about. All the details are the truth and can be seen as testimony. I could and would testify to the following in an open court.
I am thirty-five years old and have been interested in spiritual matters since my childhood. For a long time I worshipped Jesus and Padre Pio, then after reading Yogananda's Autobiography of a Yogi, I turned towards the yogi path.
In October 1988 I became an ardent follower of Sathya Sai Baba, and came to Puttaparthi for the first time in September 1989. Since then I visited Puttaparthi regularly every year and was totally absorbed in the aura of Sai Baba. I was fully convinced of his avatarhood and became so devoted that I was thinking and contemplating all the time about him alone.
In 1989 I read Lord of the Air by Tal Brooks (a young male USA ex-devotee who wrote of Sai Baba's sexual abuse of him), but I did not believe it, thinking "Tal only wants to decry Baba." I was just ignoring the facts.
My Response: Since Jens Sethi read Tal Brooke's book, Lord of the Air, in 1989, Jens Sethi should have been fully aware of the allegations of sexual impropriety made against Sathya Sai Baba. Consequently, if anything sexual occurred, between SSB and him, Jens Sethi would have had prior knowledge regarding these actions, and it should have raised a huge, red flag in Jens Sethi's mind.
Over the years I had hundreds of darshans but never an interview.
In 1993 I became a little suspicious about Sai Baba's lifestyle and the activities in the ashram. Every year I could see costly new buildings and felt an increasing commercialisation was going on. In 1996 I saw Sai Baba leaving the ashram in an expensive Jaguar and other costly cars like Mercedes and BMWs of the big class. But I still believed him to be the Kali avatar of the age.
My Response: I have only seen 3 cars that SSB uses. One is a Jaguar and I am not certain about the make or models of the other two cars. Jens Sethi is making it sounds like SSB has Mercedes (plural) and BMWs (plural). He does not. I have only seen 3 cars that SSB rides in. I know people who have more cars, and of better quality, than the ones SSB uses!
On 17th January 1996 I got my first interview and he was very kind telling me nice things like:
"I will give you everything," as he touched and stroked my head. He said "I know you're not sure about your life and future," and so on. Also unhappiness from women. I know, don't worry. Also you have some bad thoughts, not good." Then he said "I give you everything according to health, spirituality and life. Everything. I give you infinite love. You and me will become one." I touched his robe, and he put his hand on the top of my head saying "I give you separate interview."
My Response: Where was Jens Sethi's wife in this interview? It appears that Jens Sethi's wife was not with him in this interview, considering the reaction he got in his second interview.
On 20th January 1996 I got the second interview. Already days before, he had established a strange eye-contact with me indicating the coming interview. My wife and I went to the interview and he acted very disappointed at seeing me together with my wife. He took me alone into the interview room and said, "She is diseased and much older than you. Please separate from her." I was really shocked and replied, "She is attached to me."
I asked him to give her some spiritual instruction, which he readily agreed to do, but he had something else on his mind.
Without asking permission, he started kissing me on my lips for some time, and later asked me to open my trousers and "materialised" some oil which he rubbed on the skin above my genitals. I felt very bad about all of this, but accepted, as I fully trusted Sai Baba.
My Response: This simply does not make sense. SSB allegedly kissed Jens Sethi on the mouth "for some time" and materialized oil and applied it to his pubic region and Jens Sethi saw nothing wrong with this! Jens Sethi said that he "fully trusted Sai Baba". Why did Jens Sethi "fully trust Sai Baba" when he read Tal Brooke's book, Lord Of The Air? When SSB allegedly kissed Jens Sethi, a huge, red flag should have cautioned him. But it didn't!
Then he took my wife into the private interview room alone, and told her "Either you separate from the boy or I throw you out of Puttaparthi!." He appeared wild and furious (my wife told me afterwards) and she shivered all over. When she reappeared in a very short time, looking red faced and very scared, nobody dared ask her what happened in there.
He saw me again some days later in darshan and asked whether I had separated or not. I said, "No, not yet." He turned away and shouted so all people could hear "Bad, Bad boy!!!" He was so aggressive and seemed to radiate such an aura of evil that I was really shocked. We immediately left and went to north India for some pilgrimage.
My Response: This is perhaps the most damning post that casts serious doubts on Jens Sethi's testimony, against SSB. To my knowledge, SSB has never called any woman, alone, for a private, personal interview! However, this is exactly what Jens Sethi claimed happened! SSB is very careful about public perception and his interaction with women. It is completely and utterly improbable that SSB would call a woman, alone, for a private, personal interview. Not even long-term female devotees, like Phyllis Krystal, Hilda Charlton, Joy Thomas, Indra Devi or Elsie Cowan ever had a private, personal interview with SSB. Ever! It is also important to point out that Jens Sethi cannot provide even one person's name, who was in the interview room, that can corroborate his story.
It is also interesting to note that Jens Sethi perceived SSB as radiating an aura of "evil" and "aggressiveness". This affected Jens Sethi so deeply, that he and his wife "immediately left" SSB's ashram and went to North India. Again, if these actions, from SSB, truly transpired, this should have raised serious doubts in Jens Sethi's mind. Especially when Jens Sethi read Tal Brooke's book, Lord Of The Air. Despite all these things, Jens Sethi decides to go back to see SSB again!
This was a turning point, but after a time I decided to go once more to Sai Baba to clarify the matter. At the end of 1996 I returned to India and got an interview on 4th December. In the interview he said, "Where are you from?" When I told him I was from Germany, he responded "You are also a Hitler!" Shocked, I thought to myself, "He is not very kind is he?"
My Response: Combine this Hitler statement with Jens Sethi's account of SSB kissing him, materializing oil and rubbing it on his public region, SSB radiating "evil" and "aggressiveness" while publicly humilating him, telling him to separate from his wife, threatening his wife in a "wild and furious" manner and having read Tal Brooke's Lord Of The Air, Jens Sethi still continues to go back to SSB and sees nothing being wrong!
Nevertheless, in the private room the greedy old man kissed me again direct and continuously on my lips for about twenty seconds, and gently stroked my back. By now I was certain that something was very wrong.
My Response: Why didn't Jens Sethi know something was wrong the first time SSB kissed him?
On 28th December I was again called for interview and he produced a golden ring which didn't fit well on my finger in spite of his blowing on it. In the private chamber he said, "Come" and again kissed me on the lips for some time as before. This time I resisted and he gurgled, "Have no fear." I said, "I have no fear." Then he said "This is a good opportunity, so many waiting for months and will not get." This baffled me. I'm sure people don't wait for mouth kisses in Puttaparthi.
My Response: Despite knowing for certain that something was "very wrong", after the Dec. 4th interview, Jens Sethi continues to stay at the SSB's Ashram for another 24 days, attending darshans, until he is called for yet another interview! All of this sounds highly improbable and ridiculous.
Then his mood totally changed and I did have some fear. He commanded me to remove my trousers, unzipped my fly and went with his right hand into my underpants. Sathya Sai Baba the divine touched and massaged my genitals unasked. He expected some erection, but this didn't happen for I didn't feel any sexual excitement, no lust in the presence of a seventy years old man. I was really disgusted. Then he had the impudence to say, "It is very weak, don't waste energy." When I looked at him I realised the truth about him and was shocked indeed. Soon afterwards, without another word, he sent me out of the room.
Back in Germany I did intense research on the internet and came across an article from Jed Geyerhahn and was very happy to have found somebody with similar experiences.
As I still had some luggage in Puttaparthi, I returned in November 1999 to collect it, taking with me two internet pages to discuss with some friends there. Unfortunately a lady came into possession of the material and took it to the Puttaparthi police station. Then I went through several interrogations with the police there.
My Response: Jens Sethi was "very relieved" to have found someone who had similar experiences as him. Why? Did Jens Sethi forget everything he had read in Tal Brooke's book, Lord Of The Air? As if all of this isn't strange enough, Jens Sethi left his luggage at Puttaparthi (was he planning on returning again?). Three years later, Jens Sethi and his wife, return to Puttaparthi to pick up their luggage!
Now this is where things get very confusing. Jens Sethi says that he returned to Puttaparthi in November of 1999. Jens Sethi also had two Anti-SSB internet pages with him (presumably to show to others). It most certainly appears that Jens Sethi was publicly distributing these papers to others. How else did a woman come "into possession" of the material? Jens Sethi does not tell us how this lady got a hold of the Anti-SSB material.
A Mr. Reddy repeatedly asked from whom I got the material, and what would be the password. I told him India is still a democracy and I can carry whatever material I have with me, but he took no heed of my words. I told him that no password was needed to enter the net and everyone has free access to the material there. He sent me to an e-mail shop, accompanied by a policeman who waited, but the computers connected with Hydrabad are very slow, and therefore I could not enter the website.
My Response: The name of the Chief Police Inspector is Mr. Reddy. The computer connections, at Puttaparthi are relatively good (speed is equal to a dial-up connection, around 50k). Last time I was in India (2000), I never experienced a problem with the internet connections there, except when the electricity goes off.
Finally the inspector, Mr. Reddy, took my passport away and said, "Unless you give me the password and name of the person I declare you guilty and will not allow you to leave Puttaparthi." He treated me very badly, like a criminal, especially during the last interrogation and I had several witnesses to this incident. All of this because I had been in possession of two pages which I had not even written myself.
My Response: I do not doubt that Mr. Reddy took Jens Sethi's passport and treated him badly. Mr. Reddy has a horrific temper and can be very menacing and confrontive. I have heard of Mr. Reddy taking the passports of others as well.
He then walked me, my wife, and an American friend into the ashram, and once inside the gate, he again asked me the stupid question about the password. At the time I couldn't understand why he should do so, but today I know he was showing us to some people or trustees whom we could not see or recognise.
My Response: I seriously doubt that Mr. Reddy was showing Jens Sethi and his wife to "trustees". In all probability, Mr. Reddy was showing Jens and his wife to the so-called "ashram security".
I had another appointment on 1st November with the police, which was the day I intended to go to Delhi, but without my passport it would not be possible. On 30th October, late in the evening, two people whom I know and an unknown person came to our unit and one of them warned me that my life was in danger and I should leave immediately.
My Response: This is where Jens Sethi's account breaks down. First, Jens Sethi says that he and his wife returned to India in November 1999. However, this could not be true if Jens Sethi and his wife had an appointment on November 1st, 1999 with the police. Jens Sethi and his wife, did not return to India in November of 1999. They returned earlier. This is confirmed because all of this acitivity, with the police, transpired in October 1999. Jens Sethi and his wife fled Puttaparthi on November 1st 1999. Consequently, Jens Sethi gives us an inaccurate time line. In a separate letter, written to Shirley Pike, Jens Sethi was made aware of this discrepancy and he tried to compensate for it by saying, "it must be I had another appointment on 1st December......On 30th November"!
Jens Sethi also does not divulge any corroborative information about the two people, who he said he knew, and who informed him (with the help of an unknown individual) that he must leave Puttaparthi because his life was in danger. How did this unknown individual know this information? Why didn't Jens Sethi's friends, provide him with additional information about the unknown person? More loose strings.
My wife and I left very early next morning for Delhi. At Dharmmavaram rail station the police were searching for us, but we entered the train at Anantapur. There is a police station near the platform which we had to pass to enter the train, and the very moment I saw that, I told my wife to go into the train separately. My wife heard a group of policemen talking about searching for somebody and caught the words "passport,""Delhi" and "telegram" We were in serious danger but fortunately I was dressed like an Indian, and escaped identification.
My Response: This is another very unlikely story. I have traveled by trains, in India, many times. I have also purchased train tickets from Dharmavaram and Anantapur to Delhi. I know, from first hand experience, that one cannot just board a train and go to Delhi. One has to make reservations well in advance of a scheduled trip (because the trains are usually fully booked because the train comes from either Madras or Bangalore and the seats are usually booked from those cities). If you do not have a ticket on the train, you are thrown off. The only way one can purchase a train ticket, to Delhi, from Anantapur, is through a ticket counter. And even that, only several weeks prior to the date of departure. Furthermore, trains do not travel to Delhi everyday. I believe there is only a train that goes to Delhi, from Anatapur twice a week. So it is highly unusual that Jens Sethi and his wife happened to arrive in Anantapur on a day a train happened to be going to Delhi and they arrive at the exact time the train is about to leave! Also, Jens Sethi clarified that he fled Puttaparthi on December 1st, 1999. This would have made getting a train ticket even more improbable because SSB devotees would be returning home after SSB's Birthday celebrations!
What is amusing about this account, from Jens Sethi, is that he claims he escaped identification because he was "dressed like an Indian"! Jens Sethi is a German man, with white skin, who clearly looked like a foreigner. No matter how much he "dressed like an Indian", he could not pass as one! Even less, sound like an Indian! ((laughs)) There are many foreigners who dress like Indians, while in India, and they stick out like a sore thumb no matter where they are at!
So we escaped and reached Delhi, and went immediately to the German Embassy. I got a travel document after telling them of my experience, and the Embassy official said a protest note would be sent to the Indian Government. He told me such an act is illegal and they knew of similar cases.
I want to inform you that at the police station in Puttaparthi, the policeman had a bunch of both foreign and Indian passports in a drawer under a table, and once I saw them in his hand. This is just an observation, I don't know to whom they belonged.
During this frightening time at Puttaparthi, I met an Italian couple we knew there and tried to tell them what had happened to me in interview with Sai Baba. They just closed their eyes and the lady shouted, "Be quiet!! Shut up!! Sai Baba is our God, and all the bad stories are not true!!" Then they turned away. These same people had told me many years before that they could never find any peace at the ashram, and couldn't understand it. But they would not listen to those who know it better. Nobody can possibly imagine how I felt while all of this was happening. I suffered a lot.
My Response: Dr. Kovoor, an Indian Rationalist who does not believe in SSB, has said that anyone who spreads anonymous stories are "withholding information...being insincere and dishonest...conspiring...propagandizing...and having a vested interest". Using Dr. Kovoor's logic (that Anti-SSB Activists praise), Jens Sethi is "withholding information...being insincere and dishonest...conspiring...propagandizing...and having a vested interest" because he does not give us the names, or any details, about the anonymous Italian Couple.
I met one ex-soldier from Ruanda who is very tall and handsome. This person has also been sexually molested by Sai Baba, and he told me his story. He is married, and his Japanese wife is a fanatical Sai Baba supporter. They have one child. He totally depends on her and can see no way to get free from Sai Baba. He has been given many gifts from Sai Baba like rings, bracelet, gold watch. Sai Baba touched his testicles and massaged his genitals at least twice. The gifts look like payment for prostitution, but a prostitute and her customer have a mutual agreement, whereas the male devotees are molested against their will, and they come for a completely different purpose.
My Response: Jens Sethi does not give us the name, or any details, about the anonymous Ruandan man. Dr. Kovoor's logic is applicable to this account as well.
Our strong faith in Sai Baba has been misused by the same Baba, through his paedophile behaviour, and this is the most disgraceful thing he could do.
My Response: One could rightly say that Jens Sethi was the cause to most of his sufferings. Jens Sethi read Tal Brooke's book, Lord Of The Air, in 1989 and was fully aware of the accusations of sexual impropriety alleged against SSB. Jens Sethi endures SSB kissing him twice, materializing oil and rubbing it on his pubic region, SSB radiating "evil" and "aggressiveness" while publicly humilating him, telling him to separate from his wife and threatening his wife in a "wild and furious" manner and Jens Sethi continued to go back to SSB, over and over again! It is also Jens Sethi's fault for trying to disperse Anti-SSB propaganda at SSB's Ashram! He was caught and had to endure the consequences of his actions and choices.
However there are many other irregularities waiting to be clarified. I also want to let you know that Baba was willing to leave Puttaparthi on 28th November 1999 for Bangalore for a heart treatment, but he didn't because of the internet story about it. This is known to me from the police inspector who blamed me for having brought the internet pages to Puttaparthi. I have a good friend in Puttaparthi who is a shop keeper, and he had already told me that in November 1999 Baba had two heart attacks and went for treatment to Bangalore. He also said that most of the people who know about it don't believe that Sai Baba will survive the next two years.
My Response: This is an amusing comment, from Jens Sethi. Jens Sethi said that a vendor (a good friend of his), at Puttaparthi, said that SSB had two heart attacks. This vendor told Jens Sethi this information in November 1999. This story, of SSB's heart attacks, is unconfirmed. Jens Sethi said "that most of the people who know about it (the 2 heart attacks) don't believe that Sai Baba will survive the next two years". Jens Sethi gave his account in 1999. It has been 5 years since 1999, and SSB is still alive. SSB has exceeded their expectations; perhaps because SSB did not have 2 heart attacks. Furthermore, Jens Sethi contradicts himself. First, Jens Sethi says that SSB did not go for heart treatment because of the internet rumor. The Jens Sethi says that SSB did go for heart treatment, on the word of a vendor! Jens Sethi believes both accounts!
As a matter of fact, in November 1999, SSB gave a discourse on November 4th, a Deepavali discourse on November 7th, a World Youth Conference discourse on November 18th, a Woman's Day discourse on November 19th, a World Youth Conference discourse on November 21st and a Birthday discourse on November 23rd. Hardly enough time for SSB to have 2 hearts attacks, recover and give all these discourses! Also, Robert Priddy was in India in December 1999. Robert Priddy makes no mention, on his website, at all, of SSB suffering any sort of heart problems during that time.
It is also significant to point out that Jens Sethi's time line is inconsistent again. Jens Sethi claims that a vendor, from outside the Ashram, told him about SSB having heart attacks in November of 1999. Jens Sethi left Puttaparthi on November 1st, 1999, in the early morning. There was simply no time for this vendor to relate this information to Jens Sethi, especially when he was fleeing for his life in the early morning hours of Nov. 1st! Jens Sethi claims that SSB was planning to undergo heart treatment on November 28th, 1999. Jens Sethi said that SSB did not undergo this treatment because of the "internet story" about it. Jens Sethi knew this because Mr. Reddy "blamed" Jens Sethi for bringing the internet pages to Puttaparthi. Again, if Jens Sethi left Puttaparthi on November 1st, 1999, there was no way that Jens Sethi could have received any information later than Nov. 1st. However, Jens Sethi says he got information later than Nov. 1st and even upto Nov. 28th! Jens Sethi rushed to do some damage control (after someone pointed out this glaring discrepancy), in a letter to Shirley Pike, that he left India on Dec. 1st, not Nov. 1st.
The vendors outside the Ashram are not the best sources to get information. A vendor once told me that he refused to go into the ashram because there was a check point where everyone had to take off their clothes before going in! And he was completely serious! The vendors spread false rumors all the time.
The Trustees are very concerned and alarmed about the internet.
My Response: How does Jens Sethi know this? He never mentioned talking to any trustees. He says that he spoke to several devotees and the police at Puttaparthi. That's it.
Further I want to let you know (in case you do not) that Sathya Sai Baba was not born in Puttaparthi but in Karnatakka-Nagepalle village near Puttaparthi. Baba's mother came from this place and according to tradition she has to deliver the child where she comes from. I know this from a person who was born in Puttaparthi and lived there for over forty years. The villager said it is an open secret, everyone knows it but is fearful to say it. You see, from the very beginning Baba and his followers were lying.
My Response: Jens Sethu said that SSB was not born in Puttaparthi, but in "Karnatakka-Nagepalle". Whomever gave Jens Sethu this information was terribly misinformed. Nagepalle is the small village located on the opposite side of the Chitravathi river, that is located in the state of Andrah Pradesh, not Karnataka! Karnataka is the state below Andrah Pradesh from which Nagepalle is at least a hundred kilometers away! Apparently, SSB's family did live in Nagepalle for some time. This is evidenced by several building that are marked as the residences of SSB's parents. The actual birthsite of SSB is down the road from the Sathyabhama temple, in Puttaparthi, and is marked with a small temple of Shiva. This misinformation has been put on many Anti-SSB Sites. This sadly shows how quickly these Anti-SSB Sites disperse untruths.
Please study the statement Krishna, a friend of Sai Baba's youth, made to Erlendur Haraldsson. Never was a devotee so close to Sai Baba for such a long time as Krishna. He spent twenty-four hours a day with Sai Baba for some time. This was almost sixty years ago. Eventually Krishna left Sai Baba and went to Hydrabad. In an interview with Haraldsson, Krishna said that even in those days Sai Baba was more like a politician or chieftain of a feudal system. Krishna also said, "Whatever Baba may have, one thing he has not, and this is compassion."
I hope that this nightmare comes to an end and I hope that by the Grace of the Almighty, all people round the globe may know about the misdeeds of Sai Baba, a mighty demon who came in the guise of a spurious saint, only interested in self-glorification, name and fame.
He is a master - of deception.
Jens and Gurprit Sethu